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	<title>Comments on: What&#8217;s wrong with a little destruction?</title>
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	<link>http://airminded.org/2008/03/06/whats-wrong-with-a-little-destruction/</link>
	<description>Airpower and British society, 1908-1941</description>
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		<title>By: Airminded &#183; Come friendly bombs and fall on Stonehenge</title>
		<link>http://airminded.org/2008/03/06/whats-wrong-with-a-little-destruction/comment-page-1/#comment-80955</link>
		<dc:creator>Airminded &#183; Come friendly bombs and fall on Stonehenge</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 15:02:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://airminded.org/2008/03/06/whats-wrong-with-a-little-destruction/#comment-80955</guid>
		<description>[...] few months ago I looked at some visions of how aerial warfare might improve the city by blowing away ugly developments. Here&#8217;s a [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] few months ago I looked at some visions of how aerial warfare might improve the city by blowing away ugly developments. Here&#8217;s a [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Brett Holman</title>
		<link>http://airminded.org/2008/03/06/whats-wrong-with-a-little-destruction/comment-page-1/#comment-71308</link>
		<dc:creator>Brett Holman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Mar 2008 05:37:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://airminded.org/2008/03/06/whats-wrong-with-a-little-destruction/#comment-71308</guid>
		<description>Alex:

I don&#039;t know much about Betjeman, but &#039;snob&#039; does seem to be adequate for a one-word description!

What historiography are you referring to? I haven&#039;t looked very hard yet, but the American stuff I&#039;ve seen is mostly about the nuclear era. You&#039;re right, dispersal is another effect of bombing on town planning, but it didn&#039;t fit in so well with my post&#039;s title :) I can&#039;t remember where I saw it -- I thought it was Edgerton or Wohl, but it&#039;s not -- but didn&#039;t Le Corbusier explicitly design a city that was resistant to air attack? Lots of open spaces, buildings which minimised their cross-sections from above, lots of big water features which could be used by firefighters when the water mains went out. That&#039;s going to bug me now ...

Nemo:

Ah, I&#039;ve never read &lt;em&gt;Morning of the Magicians&lt;/em&gt;, though I&#039;ve heard plenty of things about it -- mostly bad (the Nazi-occult stuff in there sounds like it was basically complete rubbish). But that Goebbels statement does sound plausible, I think. Certainly Hitler spent a lot of time planning how to rebuild Berlin -- he was probably half-glad to see the place in ruins.

That Baker book does sound interesting -- there&#039;s a few familiar names in the excerpt which don&#039;t normally get up in books by generalists.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alex:</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know much about Betjeman, but &#8217;snob&#8217; does seem to be adequate for a one-word description!</p>
<p>What historiography are you referring to? I haven&#8217;t looked very hard yet, but the American stuff I&#8217;ve seen is mostly about the nuclear era. You&#8217;re right, dispersal is another effect of bombing on town planning, but it didn&#8217;t fit in so well with my post&#8217;s title :) I can&#8217;t remember where I saw it &#8212; I thought it was Edgerton or Wohl, but it&#8217;s not &#8212; but didn&#8217;t Le Corbusier explicitly design a city that was resistant to air attack? Lots of open spaces, buildings which minimised their cross-sections from above, lots of big water features which could be used by firefighters when the water mains went out. That&#8217;s going to bug me now &#8230;</p>
<p>Nemo:</p>
<p>Ah, I&#8217;ve never read <em>Morning of the Magicians</em>, though I&#8217;ve heard plenty of things about it &#8212; mostly bad (the Nazi-occult stuff in there sounds like it was basically complete rubbish). But that Goebbels statement does sound plausible, I think. Certainly Hitler spent a lot of time planning how to rebuild Berlin &#8212; he was probably half-glad to see the place in ruins.</p>
<p>That Baker book does sound interesting &#8212; there&#8217;s a few familiar names in the excerpt which don&#8217;t normally get up in books by generalists.</p>
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		<title>By: Vidi &#171; Archaeoastronomy</title>
		<link>http://airminded.org/2008/03/06/whats-wrong-with-a-little-destruction/comment-page-1/#comment-71241</link>
		<dc:creator>Vidi &#171; Archaeoastronomy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Mar 2008 08:01:25 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>[...] Airminded · What’s wrong with a little destruction? Is there something to be said for including bombing in urban planning? [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Airminded · What’s wrong with a little destruction? Is there something to be said for including bombing in urban planning? [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Nemo</title>
		<link>http://airminded.org/2008/03/06/whats-wrong-with-a-little-destruction/comment-page-1/#comment-71194</link>
		<dc:creator>Nemo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Mar 2008 00:18:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://airminded.org/2008/03/06/whats-wrong-with-a-little-destruction/#comment-71194</guid>
		<description>This post reminded me of a quote attributed to Goebbles late in the war: &quot;Under the ruins of our demolished cities the accomplishments of the stupid nineteenth century lie buried.&quot; This is quoted in Part 2, Chapter 6 of THE MORNING OF THE MAGICIANS (a/k/a THE DAWN OF MAGIC in the UK) by Jacques Bergier and Louis Pauwels. Now this isn&#039;t exactly a scholarly book, but it was a hell of a lot of fun to read when I was 16 or 17. The book is unsourced and if the quote is accurate it reflects something written by G is German and subsequently translated into French and then English. Also, it&#039;s not clear if G is talking just about 19th Century architecture or something much broader.

Since I&#039;m here I&#039;ll also mention that the American novelist Nicholson Baker has written a history of the early years of WW2 that might be somewhat up your alley. If you don&#039;t know who Baker is ( let&#039;s just say here that he is an unusual writer) there is a story about him and his new book here:

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/04/books/04bake.html?_r=1&amp;ref=books&amp;oref=slogin

and there is an excerpt from the book itself here:

http://www.simonsays.com/content/book.cfm?tab=1&amp;pid=616619&amp;agid=2</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This post reminded me of a quote attributed to Goebbles late in the war: &#8220;Under the ruins of our demolished cities the accomplishments of the stupid nineteenth century lie buried.&#8221; This is quoted in Part 2, Chapter 6 of THE MORNING OF THE MAGICIANS (a/k/a THE DAWN OF MAGIC in the UK) by Jacques Bergier and Louis Pauwels. Now this isn&#8217;t exactly a scholarly book, but it was a hell of a lot of fun to read when I was 16 or 17. The book is unsourced and if the quote is accurate it reflects something written by G is German and subsequently translated into French and then English. Also, it&#8217;s not clear if G is talking just about 19th Century architecture or something much broader.</p>
<p>Since I&#8217;m here I&#8217;ll also mention that the American novelist Nicholson Baker has written a history of the early years of WW2 that might be somewhat up your alley. If you don&#8217;t know who Baker is ( let&#8217;s just say here that he is an unusual writer) there is a story about him and his new book here:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/04/books/04bake.html?_r=1&amp;ref=books&amp;oref=slogin" rel="nofollow">http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/04/books/04bake.html?_r=1&amp;ref=books&amp;oref=slogin</a></p>
<p>and there is an excerpt from the book itself here:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.simonsays.com/content/book.cfm?tab=1&amp;pid=616619&amp;agid=2" rel="nofollow">http://www.simonsays.com/content/book.cfm?tab=1&amp;pid=616619&amp;agid=2</a></p>
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		<title>By: Alex</title>
		<link>http://airminded.org/2008/03/06/whats-wrong-with-a-little-destruction/comment-page-1/#comment-71173</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Mar 2008 12:48:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://airminded.org/2008/03/06/whats-wrong-with-a-little-destruction/#comment-71173</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.chrisgreen.co.uk/202/poem-of-the-day/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Whoops&lt;/a&gt;; misquoted.

&lt;em&gt;Gaily into Ruislip Gardens
Runs the red electric train,
With a thousand Ta’s and Pardon’s
Daintily alights Elaine;&lt;/em&gt;

Reading the rest, I think my point is only reinforced.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.chrisgreen.co.uk/202/poem-of-the-day/" rel="nofollow">Whoops</a>; misquoted.</p>
<p><em>Gaily into Ruislip Gardens<br />
Runs the red electric train,<br />
With a thousand Ta’s and Pardon’s<br />
Daintily alights Elaine;</em></p>
<p>Reading the rest, I think my point is only reinforced.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex</title>
		<link>http://airminded.org/2008/03/06/whats-wrong-with-a-little-destruction/comment-page-1/#comment-71170</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Mar 2008 11:25:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://airminded.org/2008/03/06/whats-wrong-with-a-little-destruction/#comment-71170</guid>
		<description>Or alternatively, rather than building underground, move these things out to the suburbs. Dispersal. It fit quite well with many interpretations of Le Corbusier&#039;s cite radieuse; all those white buildings in parks linked by superbly-landscaped highways. There&#039;s some interesting historiography mostly by American leftie/cultural studies types (so bring a sack of caveats) about the influence of air dread on suburban development.

Coming from a family with a new town background, I have to say that rereading &lt;em&gt;Slough&lt;/em&gt; after a few years leaves me a bit cold. Slough is a dump, sure enough, and Betjeman does a job of snarking it, but I bet it beat the piss out of 1930s Woolwich or Brixton, and there&#039;s a metric shitload of snobbery in there. To say nothing of the &quot;everything was better on the land, and maybe having London coventrated would get us back there - it&#039;s only a few million dead poor people&quot; meme.

Curiously, Betjeman managed to combine this kind of hymn of hate for modernism with reams of stuff about how wonderful the Underground, especially the Metropolitan Line, and the north-west London suburbs (built at the same time) were; out by RAF Northolt and Bentley Priory, mark. The key is of course class: &lt;em&gt;Into neat West Ruislip station/Pulls the bright electric train/With a thousand Ta&#039;s and Pardons/Daintily alights Elaine&lt;/em&gt;...She obviously wouldn&#039;t ever paint her nails, and therefore she gets a slot in the air raid shelter. But she does sound fucking incredibly dull.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Or alternatively, rather than building underground, move these things out to the suburbs. Dispersal. It fit quite well with many interpretations of Le Corbusier&#8217;s cite radieuse; all those white buildings in parks linked by superbly-landscaped highways. There&#8217;s some interesting historiography mostly by American leftie/cultural studies types (so bring a sack of caveats) about the influence of air dread on suburban development.</p>
<p>Coming from a family with a new town background, I have to say that rereading <em>Slough</em> after a few years leaves me a bit cold. Slough is a dump, sure enough, and Betjeman does a job of snarking it, but I bet it beat the piss out of 1930s Woolwich or Brixton, and there&#8217;s a metric shitload of snobbery in there. To say nothing of the &#8220;everything was better on the land, and maybe having London coventrated would get us back there &#8211; it&#8217;s only a few million dead poor people&#8221; meme.</p>
<p>Curiously, Betjeman managed to combine this kind of hymn of hate for modernism with reams of stuff about how wonderful the Underground, especially the Metropolitan Line, and the north-west London suburbs (built at the same time) were; out by RAF Northolt and Bentley Priory, mark. The key is of course class: <em>Into neat West Ruislip station/Pulls the bright electric train/With a thousand Ta&#8217;s and Pardons/Daintily alights Elaine</em>&#8230;She obviously wouldn&#8217;t ever paint her nails, and therefore she gets a slot in the air raid shelter. But she does sound fucking incredibly dull.</p>
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