Comments on: G’tag von Zeppelinburg! http://airminded.org/2007/09/30/gtag-von-zeppelinburg/ Airpower and British society, 1908-1941 Fri, 29 Aug 2008 23:09:30 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5.1 By: Brett Holman http://airminded.org/2007/09/30/gtag-von-zeppelinburg/#comment-71148 Brett Holman Wed, 05 Mar 2008 16:11:41 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/09/30/gtag-von-zeppelinburg/#comment-71148 Interesting, Cory, thanks. But if that's the case, what exactly would be the threat that Australians are supposed to rise up against, if not a German victory? Presumably not that ethnic Germans in Australia would somehow take over and rename the major cities -- there would be far too few of them, even in South Australia, for that to be a credible threat. (Not that that's ever stopped anybody before ...) A recruiting poster (which is what the <em>Daily Mail</em> said it was) makes more sense to me (possibly with an implicit accusation that ethnic Germans would welcome a German victory and take over the country if that happened). But I freely admit that I don't know a lot about Australian history, even in my period ... so I could be wrong! Here's an interesting link on Germanophobia in Australia in WWI (though perhaps not unbiased): http://www.teachers.ash.org.au/dnutting/germanaustralia/e/ww1.htm Interesting, Cory, thanks. But if that’s the case, what exactly would be the threat that Australians are supposed to rise up against, if not a German victory? Presumably not that ethnic Germans in Australia would somehow take over and rename the major cities — there would be far too few of them, even in South Australia, for that to be a credible threat. (Not that that’s ever stopped anybody before …) A recruiting poster (which is what the Daily Mail said it was) makes more sense to me (possibly with an implicit accusation that ethnic Germans would welcome a German victory and take over the country if that happened). But I freely admit that I don’t know a lot about Australian history, even in my period … so I could be wrong!

Here’s an interesting link on Germanophobia in Australia in WWI (though perhaps not unbiased): http://www.teachers.ash.org.au/dnutting/germanaustralia/e/ww1.htm

]]> By: Cory Olsen http://airminded.org/2007/09/30/gtag-von-zeppelinburg/#comment-71133 Cory Olsen Wed, 05 Mar 2008 10:07:48 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/09/30/gtag-von-zeppelinburg/#comment-71133 My understanding was that the main reason such posters were created were part of the propaganda of the war at home. Ie; specifically in relation to the plethora of German place names in Australia (particularly in the southern states although Queensland had its share prior to the "Great War"). My understanding was that the main reason such posters were created were part of the propaganda of the war at home.

Ie; specifically in relation to the plethora of German place names in Australia (particularly in the southern states although Queensland had its share prior to the “Great War”).

]]> By: Brett Holman http://airminded.org/2007/09/30/gtag-von-zeppelinburg/#comment-61205 Brett Holman Wed, 03 Oct 2007 10:08:47 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/09/30/gtag-von-zeppelinburg/#comment-61205 That Berlin->Kitchener link is quite interesting; if it's accurate it seems that a small minority of people who felt very strongly about the issue were able to intimidate the rest of the population into letting the change pass; less than a thousand people bothered to vote out of a total population of 15000. Possibly because the option of keeping Berlin wasn't even available! That Berlin->Kitchener link is quite interesting; if it’s accurate it seems that a small minority of people who felt very strongly about the issue were able to intimidate the rest of the population into letting the change pass; less than a thousand people bothered to vote out of a total population of 15000. Possibly because the option of keeping Berlin wasn’t even available!

]]> By: Alan Allport http://airminded.org/2007/09/30/gtag-von-zeppelinburg/#comment-61092 Alan Allport Mon, 01 Oct 2007 22:20:07 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/09/30/gtag-von-zeppelinburg/#comment-61092 My wife works in <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berlin,_New_Jersey" rel="nofollow">Berlin, New Jersey</a>, and I've sometimes wondered how that town got through the 'liberty cabbage' stage of World War One unscathed when its <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berlin_to_Kitchener_name_change" rel="nofollow">larger namesake in Ontario didn't</a>. My wife works in Berlin, New Jersey, and I’ve sometimes wondered how that town got through the ‘liberty cabbage’ stage of World War One unscathed when its larger namesake in Ontario didn’t.

]]> By: Brett Holman http://airminded.org/2007/09/30/gtag-von-zeppelinburg/#comment-61073 Brett Holman Mon, 01 Oct 2007 13:22:32 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/09/30/gtag-von-zeppelinburg/#comment-61073 Not a lot of people know that -- well I certainly didn't! There were definitely some German place-names which escaped, such as Heidelberg, Brunswick, and Altona in Melbourne (a few more listed <a href="http://www.teachers.ash.org.au/dnutting/Germanaustralia/e/ortsnamen.htm" rel="nofollow">here</a>) -- maybe the royal connection saved the first two? Not a lot of people know that — well I certainly didn’t! There were definitely some German place-names which escaped, such as Heidelberg, Brunswick, and Altona in Melbourne (a few more listed here) — maybe the royal connection saved the first two?

]]> By: Chris Williams http://airminded.org/2007/09/30/gtag-von-zeppelinburg/#comment-61061 Chris Williams Mon, 01 Oct 2007 08:42:50 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/09/30/gtag-von-zeppelinburg/#comment-61061 Back to Zeppelingburg . . . there was quite a lot of name-changing in Germanspeaking bits of Oz, but the traffic all went the other way: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_place_names_changed_from_German_names Some the names that the poor old Aussies of German origin had to adopt could be construed as rubbing it in: 'Vimy Ridge', 'Jellicoe', Jutland, 'Sturdee', 'Allenby', etc Back to Zeppelingburg . . . there was quite a lot of name-changing in Germanspeaking bits of Oz, but the traffic all went the other way:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_place_names_changed_from_German_names

Some the names that the poor old Aussies of German origin had to adopt could be construed as rubbing it in: ‘Vimy Ridge’, ‘Jellicoe’, Jutland, ‘Sturdee’, ‘Allenby’, etc

]]> By: Brett Holman http://airminded.org/2007/09/30/gtag-von-zeppelinburg/#comment-61025 Brett Holman Sun, 30 Sep 2007 12:29:10 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/09/30/gtag-von-zeppelinburg/#comment-61025 Well -- firstly I don't think Japan ever had any serious short- or medium-term plans to invade Australia; they certainly didn't have the capability. (There are certainly those who would <a href="http://www.users.bigpond.com/battleforAustralia/battaust/AustInvasion/Confronting_revisionists.html" rel="nofollow">disagree</a> with this.) But having said that, I <em>think</em> there was some planning done, but later, in 1943 or 1944 by the Ministry of Economics or something like that -- possibly in relation to Australia's future role in the Co-prosperity Sphere. I can't remember where I came across this though ... might have been Henry P. Frei, <em>Japan's Southward Advance and Australia: From the Sixteenth Century to World War II</em> (Honolulu: University of Hawaii Press, 1991). Well — firstly I don’t think Japan ever had any serious short- or medium-term plans to invade Australia; they certainly didn’t have the capability. (There are certainly those who would disagree with this.) But having said that, I think there was some planning done, but later, in 1943 or 1944 by the Ministry of Economics or something like that — possibly in relation to Australia’s future role in the Co-prosperity Sphere. I can’t remember where I came across this though … might have been Henry P. Frei, Japan’s Southward Advance and Australia: From the Sixteenth Century to World War II (Honolulu: University of Hawaii Press, 1991).

]]> By: Alan Allport http://airminded.org/2007/09/30/gtag-von-zeppelinburg/#comment-61019 Alan Allport Sun, 30 Sep 2007 11:02:12 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/09/30/gtag-von-zeppelinburg/#comment-61019 At a slightly less fantastic level of contigency, has anyone ever dug up any specific post-invasion plans that the Japanese might have had in 1942? At a slightly less fantastic level of contigency, has anyone ever dug up any specific post-invasion plans that the Japanese might have had in 1942?

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