Comments on: War games http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/ Airpower and British society, 1908-1941 Sat, 21 Nov 2009 04:15:39 -0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: Brett Holman http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/comment-page-1/#comment-65826 Brett Holman Wed, 05 Dec 2007 07:40:03 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/#comment-65826 That <a href="http://www.boardgamegeek.com/game/32697" rel="nofollow">Diplomacy</a> looks like it was inspired by Monopoly? I'm just amazed that so many of these ancient games (and their flag update kits!) can still be bought; I've only experienced them through museums and archives. It's probably just as well that I'm a poor student with no money to spare for such things ... That Diplomacy looks like it was inspired by Monopoly?

I’m just amazed that so many of these ancient games (and their flag update kits!) can still be bought; I’ve only experienced them through museums and archives. It’s probably just as well that I’m a poor student with no money to spare for such things …

]]> By: Dan Cermak http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/comment-page-1/#comment-65742 Dan Cermak Tue, 04 Dec 2007 12:52:36 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/#comment-65742 Its a mix of English, Australian, German and American games. I only have 1 French game from the period. I have about 80 antique games now. There is one game called HV Kalterborn's Diplomacy that was made in England in 1939 and had a Nazi Germany flag on the map. The outbreak of war caused the sales to drop due to people not wanting to have a game with a Nazi flag on it. The publishers created a kit of stickers so that people could change the maps to the old German Republic and even the Russian flag so that it wasn't communist. I have a couple sets of the add on flags. The history is fascinating. Its a mix of English, Australian, German and American games. I only have 1 French game from the period. I have about 80 antique games now.

There is one game called HV Kalterborn’s Diplomacy that was made in England in 1939 and had a Nazi Germany flag on the map. The outbreak of war caused the sales to drop due to people not wanting to have a game with a Nazi flag on it. The publishers created a kit of stickers so that people could change the maps to the old German Republic and even the Russian flag so that it wasn’t communist. I have a couple sets of the add on flags. The history is fascinating.

]]> By: Brett Holman http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/comment-page-1/#comment-65732 Brett Holman Tue, 04 Dec 2007 09:46:33 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/#comment-65732 Wow, that's fantastic, Dan. And I'm jealous. So many games I'd never heard of! Some very interesting ones too, like <a href="http://www.boardgamegeek.com/game/32952" rel="nofollow"><em>Blitz (the air raid game)</em></a>. Also, far better pictures of some of the components than I have (e.g. the map for <a href="http://www.boardgamegeek.com/image/266003?size=large" rel="nofollow"><em>War Tactics</em></a>. So thanks for that. Are the majority American games? Wow, that’s fantastic, Dan. And I’m jealous. So many games I’d never heard of! Some very interesting ones too, like Blitz (the air raid game). Also, far better pictures of some of the components than I have (e.g. the map for War Tactics. So thanks for that.

Are the majority American games?

]]> By: Dan Cermak http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/comment-page-1/#comment-65711 Dan Cermak Mon, 03 Dec 2007 23:13:33 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/#comment-65711 Very interesting post. I have an extensive antique wargame and strategy game collection (1890s - 1950) that I recently put up on Boardgamegeek. I set up three geeklists as they are called them so that people could get a feel for the history of strategy games (real wargames back then were few and far between but Invasion, War Tactics and a couple others fit the bill). They can be viewed here: http://www.boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/26146 http://www.boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/26555 http://www.boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/26557 It's the majority of my collection (I have the Gibson games and a few others that were already present on BGG. If you have any questions or want any follow up information on the games in my collection feel free to ask. Very interesting post. I have an extensive antique wargame and strategy game collection (1890s – 1950) that I recently put up on Boardgamegeek.

I set up three geeklists as they are called them so that people could get a feel for the history of strategy games (real wargames back then were few and far between but Invasion, War Tactics and a couple others fit the bill).

They can be viewed here:

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/26146

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/26555

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/26557

It’s the majority of my collection (I have the Gibson games and a few others that were already present on BGG. If you have any questions or want any follow up information on the games in my collection feel free to ask.

]]> By: Airminded · The Raider http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/comment-page-1/#comment-59204 Airminded · The Raider Wed, 05 Sep 2007 18:21:34 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/#comment-59204 [...] another British war game, this one from 1922: The Raider. A copy of a new game called “The Raider” has been [...] [...] another British war game, this one from 1922: The Raider. A copy of a new game called “The Raider” has been [...]

]]> By: Airminded · War games: tabloid edition http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/comment-page-1/#comment-57841 Airminded · War games: tabloid edition Mon, 20 Aug 2007 22:40:35 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/#comment-57841 [...] even juvenile ones. But of course, as I’ve discussed here recently, British children played war games too, so it’s really rather silly to pretend that they spent the whole war playing [...] [...] even juvenile ones. But of course, as I’ve discussed here recently, British children played war games too, so it’s really rather silly to pretend that they spent the whole war playing [...]

]]> By: Brett Holman http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/comment-page-1/#comment-57782 Brett Holman Sun, 19 Aug 2007 16:57:14 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/#comment-57782 Well that's two for <em>Dover Patrol</em>, I'd be interested to hear from anyone who's played <em>Tri-Tactics</em>. I wonder if it's just a coincidence that this series stopped being made (and presumably was losing sales) in the 1960s-70s, when the US wargaming industry was getting going ... Well that’s two for Dover Patrol, I’d be interested to hear from anyone who’s played Tri-Tactics. I wonder if it’s just a coincidence that this series stopped being made (and presumably was losing sales) in the 1960s-70s, when the US wargaming industry was getting going …

]]> By: Jonathan Jarrett http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/comment-page-1/#comment-57569 Jonathan Jarrett Thu, 16 Aug 2007 23:57:59 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/#comment-57569 Just wanted to say, I have a copy of <a href="http://www.boardgamegeek.com/game/2606" rel="nofollow">Dover Patrol</a> at home here and it's afforded me many hours of unrealistic amusement. It's currently waiting for me to to lay hold of enough new stands for the pieces that the essential anonymity of the pieces can be maintained once more; the old ones split very easily. Since it has plastic stands I guess it must be a late printing (it has flying boats that are clearly Sunderlands so is I guess a 1950s update of a much earlier game). But just out of relevance to your post I thought I'd say that the covers of the rule booklet wears advertisements for L'Attaque and Tri-Tactics, so Gibson presumably did well out of this self-reinforcement. Just wanted to say, I have a copy of Dover Patrol at home here and it’s afforded me many hours of unrealistic amusement. It’s currently waiting for me to to lay hold of enough new stands for the pieces that the essential anonymity of the pieces can be maintained once more; the old ones split very easily. Since it has plastic stands I guess it must be a late printing (it has flying boats that are clearly Sunderlands so is I guess a 1950s update of a much earlier game). But just out of relevance to your post I thought I’d say that the covers of the rule booklet wears advertisements for L’Attaque and Tri-Tactics, so Gibson presumably did well out of this self-reinforcement.

]]> By: Brett Holman http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/comment-page-1/#comment-57038 Brett Holman Fri, 10 Aug 2007 20:09:32 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/#comment-57038 Paul: Saying it's far superior to <em>Battleships</em> is not saying very much, as that's not much of a game of skill (except perhaps in devising search patterns!) Was <em>Dover Patrol</em> basically <em>Stratego</em>? Nemo: I found both <a href="http://www.boardgamegeek.com/game/1509" rel="nofollow"><em>Dogfight</em></a> and <a href="http://www.boardgamegeek.com/game/1508" rel="nofollow"><em>Broadside</em></a> at BoardGameGeek, and you're right, they were part of a <a href="http://www.boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/1584" rel="nofollow">series</a>. These games look to be a bit more complex than <em>Aviation</em> etc, the influence of <a hef="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tactics_II" rel="nofollow">Tactics II</a> probably. George: Well spotted! I'd never heard of it; there's a <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birch_gun" rel="nofollow">Wikipedia</a> page and what seems to be a photo <a href="http://community.livejournal.com/shushpanzer_ru/32367.html" rel="nofollow">here</a> (the text is mostly in Russian, but it's tagged "birch gun"). It does indeed look very much like the "tank" just under the searchlight beam, in particular. I wonder if it's just convergent evolution -- take an artillery piece with gun shield, lop off the wheels and stick it on top of a tank chassis (the searchlight and even the observation balloon on the cover seem similarly to be attached to the top of a tank). I don't have a firm date on the game, though, other than c. 1920, the Birch was apparently built in 1925, so it's not entirely impossible. Brisfits (the only real aeroplane named in the game) were still in service with the RAF at that time as well, though I think not as fighters any more. Paul:

Saying it’s far superior to Battleships is not saying very much, as that’s not much of a game of skill (except perhaps in devising search patterns!) Was Dover Patrol basically Stratego?

Nemo:

I found both Dogfight and Broadside at BoardGameGeek, and you’re right, they were part of a series. These games look to be a bit more complex than Aviation etc, the influence of Tactics II probably.

George:

Well spotted! I’d never heard of it; there’s a Wikipedia page and what seems to be a photo here (the text is mostly in Russian, but it’s tagged “birch gun”). It does indeed look very much like the “tank” just under the searchlight beam, in particular. I wonder if it’s just convergent evolution — take an artillery piece with gun shield, lop off the wheels and stick it on top of a tank chassis (the searchlight and even the observation balloon on the cover seem similarly to be attached to the top of a tank). I don’t have a firm date on the game, though, other than c. 1920, the Birch was apparently built in 1925, so it’s not entirely impossible. Brisfits (the only real aeroplane named in the game) were still in service with the RAF at that time as well, though I think not as fighters any more.

]]> By: George Shaner http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/comment-page-1/#comment-56796 George Shaner Tue, 07 Aug 2007 22:57:43 +0000 http://airminded.org/2007/08/05/war-games/#comment-56796 Those AFVs on the cover of "Aviation" look a great deal like the so-called "Birch Gun," which was a period British effort at an self-propelled gun, and which also had a flak role if I'm not mistaken. Those AFVs on the cover of “Aviation” look a great deal like the so-called “Birch Gun,” which was a period British effort at an self-propelled gun, and which also had a flak role if I’m not mistaken.

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